I actually had this experience recently. I grew up eating meat but have been considering giving it up and eventually becoming vegan. Thing is, no one around me is vegan so I’d need some kind of support network. It’s hard to walk away from ham if that’s what you know and love. I posted a pretty innocuous question to one of the vegan communities and the general response was that it was a stupid question, I should already know the answer, and I shouldn’t waste time posting questions like that. All that told me that if I were to go down this road, I’d be walking alone. So making the switch feels a lot harder and seems a lot more daunting. Not saying I’m giving up on it, but I definitely find it more intimidating knowing that if I try to find a network, I’ll be scolded for being a newb.
I only became vegan once I moved to a city where that was more socially accepted. 8 years later, my family is still warming up to the idea. Having vegan friends definitely helps in the transition.
In the meantime, make better choices whenever you can.
Yup, trying. The siren call of milk and cheese is strong, but my red meat consumption is definitely down. Most pork is gone from my diet. Even bacon is a rarity. I recently discovered that I don’t hate oat milk. So I’m making progress, but still have a lot more to do.
After years not touching dairy, milk and butter taste absolutely putrid to me. Oat milk is the best taste-value wise, but soy is still king nutricionally.
You would think that they would be overly helpful when all they do is say it’s the moral way to eat. Looking down on everyone who eats meat and then give you shit for trying to be on their side…weird.
I’ve personally spent a decent amount of time in vegan and vegan debate subreddits, so I could probably offer a bit of insight. My general approach goal was to be helpful and non-judgemental as possible, but to also be assertive. There are a few caveats in no particular order:
If a post hits r/all, you get a lot of mean and rude people, as well as trolls. Suffering them gets draining. It’s basically the cashier “it’s not ringing up so it’s free?” joke equivalent, but worse since it’s not even in good faith. There’s only so many times you can read “loll bacon” without getting a little depressed about humanity.
For those that aren’t trolling, many are highly misinformed. It can be challenging to manage their experience and present information in a way that doesn’t bruise their ego a little. I’ve slowly learned to get better at this, but it’s a process.
Both people who were helpful and those who were rude helped me transition to veganism. The “rude” vegans often raised cognitive dissonance the most and really forced me to think things through myself. I’m sure there are plenty of people who might not respond in this way, but it did help me, and a lot of other vegans have said the same.
Being vegan can be kinda depressing. When the large majority of society performs actions that you believe to be immoral, and you still have to integrate, it starts to tear at you a little. Sometimes it’s just too much to put up with, and a mean little joke at someone else’s expense slips out. That’s why we had places specifically for that sort of venting. But then people (usually with an agenda) would point to those places, and use them as examples, and you get the MEAN VEGAN stereotype.
A lot of them do it for the dopamine of feeling better about it. Not out of a rational decision to be better. Most people live and die by what gives them their feel good chemicals
It’s just human psychology. A lot of them do it as much because it makes them feel superior to others as for moral reasons. People failing at it makes them that much more special for succeeding.
Yeah that’s the thing. Difficult changes are difficult. Sometimes that’s not an excuse for pushing labor on strangers. Walking away from bigotry is hard but vulnerable people shouldn’t have to constantly justify their existence. But a lot of the time you need to answer the stupid questions you may not have asked. I went pescatarian quickly, and it was less hard than expected, but it took several people I know doing it before I felt comfortable.
Newbs are how you get people in your group. Nobody wants to join groups that were mean to them even if they want to do the thing the group does.
I looked at your post briefly, and it seemed like asides from one or two down voted responses, you got a majority of fairly informative answers, no?
I know when I’ve had a conversation that I’ve felt was overly negative, sometimes I’ll go and review it again after a time so I can be a bit more objective and consider if negativity bias wasn’t playing a part in my initial assessment.
If you’ve got any more questions, I hope you’ll still ask. I think the majority of us would be happy to answer!
Actually, it is a rather life-changing and in some parts dangerous “adventure.” This is mainly because you need to keep a well-balanced diet not to get a lot of health issues, plus there are a lot of questions of what and how to cook that will also require research. All-in-all there are a lot of difficulties and having some support is always good even in minor things.
Yea, like I love ice cream. Non-dairy ice cream, not so much. So the thought of walking away from one of my life’s great pleasures is daunting.
I don’t just like food. I LOVE food. I pick my vacation spots for the food. I’ll suffer through a boring work trip if it means new restaurants to try out. Going vegan will definitely impact how I approach food, social gatherings, meal prep, etc. It’s a lot.
Yeah, in such a case it will have an even bigger impact. Just don’t forget to take stuff like vitamins and other supplements that may be sparse after diet change, as it may also affect you
I actually had this experience recently. I grew up eating meat but have been considering giving it up and eventually becoming vegan. Thing is, no one around me is vegan so I’d need some kind of support network. It’s hard to walk away from ham if that’s what you know and love. I posted a pretty innocuous question to one of the vegan communities and the general response was that it was a stupid question, I should already know the answer, and I shouldn’t waste time posting questions like that. All that told me that if I were to go down this road, I’d be walking alone. So making the switch feels a lot harder and seems a lot more daunting. Not saying I’m giving up on it, but I definitely find it more intimidating knowing that if I try to find a network, I’ll be scolded for being a newb.
I only became vegan once I moved to a city where that was more socially accepted. 8 years later, my family is still warming up to the idea. Having vegan friends definitely helps in the transition.
In the meantime, make better choices whenever you can.
Yup, trying. The siren call of milk and cheese is strong, but my red meat consumption is definitely down. Most pork is gone from my diet. Even bacon is a rarity. I recently discovered that I don’t hate oat milk. So I’m making progress, but still have a lot more to do.
After years not touching dairy, milk and butter taste absolutely putrid to me. Oat milk is the best taste-value wise, but soy is still king nutricionally.
I’d drink horchata all day if I could, but that probably wouldn’t be too healthy.
You would think that they would be overly helpful when all they do is say it’s the moral way to eat. Looking down on everyone who eats meat and then give you shit for trying to be on their side…weird.
I’ve personally spent a decent amount of time in vegan and vegan debate subreddits, so I could probably offer a bit of insight. My general approach goal was to be helpful and non-judgemental as possible, but to also be assertive. There are a few caveats in no particular order:
If a post hits r/all, you get a lot of mean and rude people, as well as trolls. Suffering them gets draining. It’s basically the cashier “it’s not ringing up so it’s free?” joke equivalent, but worse since it’s not even in good faith. There’s only so many times you can read “loll bacon” without getting a little depressed about humanity.
For those that aren’t trolling, many are highly misinformed. It can be challenging to manage their experience and present information in a way that doesn’t bruise their ego a little. I’ve slowly learned to get better at this, but it’s a process.
Both people who were helpful and those who were rude helped me transition to veganism. The “rude” vegans often raised cognitive dissonance the most and really forced me to think things through myself. I’m sure there are plenty of people who might not respond in this way, but it did help me, and a lot of other vegans have said the same.
Being vegan can be kinda depressing. When the large majority of society performs actions that you believe to be immoral, and you still have to integrate, it starts to tear at you a little. Sometimes it’s just too much to put up with, and a mean little joke at someone else’s expense slips out. That’s why we had places specifically for that sort of venting. But then people (usually with an agenda) would point to those places, and use them as examples, and you get the MEAN VEGAN stereotype.
Exactly! It felt like going to a church that immediately condemns its parishioners and then wonders why it has no parishioners.
A lot of them do it for the dopamine of feeling better about it. Not out of a rational decision to be better. Most people live and die by what gives them their feel good chemicals
It’s just human psychology. A lot of them do it as much because it makes them feel superior to others as for moral reasons. People failing at it makes them that much more special for succeeding.
Yeah that’s the thing. Difficult changes are difficult. Sometimes that’s not an excuse for pushing labor on strangers. Walking away from bigotry is hard but vulnerable people shouldn’t have to constantly justify their existence. But a lot of the time you need to answer the stupid questions you may not have asked. I went pescatarian quickly, and it was less hard than expected, but it took several people I know doing it before I felt comfortable.
Newbs are how you get people in your group. Nobody wants to join groups that were mean to them even if they want to do the thing the group does.
I looked at your post briefly, and it seemed like asides from one or two down voted responses, you got a majority of fairly informative answers, no?
I know when I’ve had a conversation that I’ve felt was overly negative, sometimes I’ll go and review it again after a time so I can be a bit more objective and consider if negativity bias wasn’t playing a part in my initial assessment.
If you’ve got any more questions, I hope you’ll still ask. I think the majority of us would be happy to answer!
Can we be friends, internet stranger?
Sure! _
You say that as if being vegan is a life changing adventure that you have to go through great efforts and risks to venture.
Like, just don’t eat milk products (etc), it’s not that big of a deal
Actually, it is a rather life-changing and in some parts dangerous “adventure.” This is mainly because you need to keep a well-balanced diet not to get a lot of health issues, plus there are a lot of questions of what and how to cook that will also require research. All-in-all there are a lot of difficulties and having some support is always good even in minor things.
Yea, like I love ice cream. Non-dairy ice cream, not so much. So the thought of walking away from one of my life’s great pleasures is daunting.
I don’t just like food. I LOVE food. I pick my vacation spots for the food. I’ll suffer through a boring work trip if it means new restaurants to try out. Going vegan will definitely impact how I approach food, social gatherings, meal prep, etc. It’s a lot.
Yeah, in such a case it will have an even bigger impact. Just don’t forget to take stuff like vitamins and other supplements that may be sparse after diet change, as it may also affect you
Will do! I’m actually starting to feel excited about this.