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No, electric vehicle sales aren’t dropping. Here’s what’s really going on::Tesla has been slashing prices. Ford just cut the price of its Mustang Mach-E, too, plus it cut back production of its electric pickup. And General Motors is thinking about bringing back plug-in hybrids, arguably a step back from EVs.
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Btw, in Norway 92% of new car sales in January were electric cars, and apparently predictions for February are even higher.
When the infrastructure is there, people appear to have little to no qualms buying electric cars.
Norway has a range of subsidies worth up to half the price of the vehicle and home upgrades plus tax exemptions worth another 25% on top of that.
Which can mean a brand new EV is the same price as an old secondhand ICE.
Incentives like that are a lot easier your entire national population is smaller than some cities.
The reason why Europe can pull off progressive reforms has nothing to do with population or geography, Europe is bigger than the US on both fronts. It has to do with political will.
I only meant to say that many of the things that might put people off buying electric cars, like range concerns etc. can be alleviated.
Even with subsidies and incentives it was slow going in the beginning, before people gained trust in the infrastructure and realized electric could be a real and practical alternative.
I didn’t mean to be an asshole, sorry.
You weren’t an asshole
How does a smaller population make it easier to pay those incentives? Less people also means less tax income and vice versa
Norway is 1/30th the size of the US and everyone lives in the bottom half, so traveling your country is like traveling a state in the US, and not one of the big states. That makes it really easy to have smaller range EV’S a viable option and requires orders of magnitudes less public charging stations. Everything is easy when your entire country only consists of a bit over five million people.
Just because the borders are drawn around a bigger or smaller area, doesn’t change how long people need to drive when they wanna get somewhere
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How they got rich doesn’t change their sales figures. Other countries that got rich in different ways could apply the same techniques.
No, you are right. But I do think most countries do use the same techniques, the problem is they can’t give subsidies for up to 50% of the new car price. It is simply not sustainable. There are also not enough cars to go around even if they did and even if most people had enough money burning in their pocket for a new car, which they don’t.
I just find the how they got rich ironic…
I’m in the market for a BEV. Have been for 3 years. The reason I don’t have one is:
A. The cars that are large enough for my use case (weekend getaways with kids and or friends) are all super expensive luxury vehicles with poor ratings.
B. Availability. Other than the Mustang Mach-E, nothing is available here (Canada) without a minimum 6 month wait list. (Ioniq 5 is 1 year).
C. Poor reliability and/or features. (See the disaster that is the Chevy Blazer EV).
At this point I’m waiting for the Ioniq 7. Hopefully it will be as well reviewed as it’s sister the EV9.
The reason GM and Ford are not selling well is because nobody wants what they’re selling. But they’re framing it as an general EV issue and not a crap product issue.
The media and those apposed to EVs are buying it of course.
I’m considering to get a Polestar 2 for many reasons but also because… No waiting time 😉
Oh yeah, forgot that one. Way too small for me, but a really nice car. If the Polestar 3 wasn’t so stupid expensive, I’d love to get that.
Picked up a used 2022 Polestar 2 about 6 months ago for nearly half off. No regrets, because it’s an awesome car, and I strongly recommend it
What did it cost you?
I got a lyric and I love ot
Is it so much to ask that I be able to get a vehicle that’s just…normal but also an EV? Not a monster truck, not some space ship looking thing, just like a Honda Accord but an EV…I don’t think that’s asking so much but apparently automakers disagree.
There are a few companies that do this. Tesla, Kia, and Nissan come to mind. I’m not sure what’s available in your location though.
The reason GM and Ford are not selling well is because nobody wants what they’re selling. But they’re framing it as an general EV issue and not a crap product issue.
Its GM, Ford, Rivian, Lucid.
Tesla only managed to get close to their targets by dropping prices dramatically.
Rivian and Lucid are exclusively luxury brands. Not shocked that they’re having a hard time pushing cars over 100k CAD. I don’t think they’re atracting the same media attention either.
I still find it super weird. A (remote) coworker bought an ioniq 5 after 9 months on a wait list… 3 months later, I went to a dealership. they had one on the lot (3 actually). Was able to get one with 0 wait.
Looking at their website, they have 4 2024 ioniq 5s available right now, an SEL, SE, and 2x Limited.
So apparently my local dealership is the sweet spot. Or is this purely a Canada vs US thing?
Yes, availability in the US is much better. You can find a base ioniq 5 here easily now, but nobody wants those. Everyone wants the long range AWD.
Yeah, I want a Mach-E (at least in theory) … but I want it to have a good 500-600 mile range (or for the charging network to be much bigger than it is)… It’s unfortunate really
Is the charging network that bad in the US that you need to get that far without charging?
So for me I make a trek to my parents house ~150 miles away a few times a year.
In good weather (and good battery condition), I could might be skip hitting the chargers all together, or get a little bit of charging at my parents house from a wall outlet.
Unless my parents (or my grandfather that I also visit fairly regularly who lives the same distance in a different direction) installed a better charger at their place… In colder weather (e.g. Christmas), I’d almost definitely need to use a charger while going at least one direction.
The problem is, in both cases, there are like 5-10 charges total (not charging stations, chargers) where as there are like 5-10 gas stations all right next to the interstate each with at least 4 pumps, many with 8+ pumps.
I’m concerned that during peak travel in cold weather (e.g. Christmas time travel), I could easily find myself in a bad situation where I can’t get a charger because they’re all too far away, broken, or in use. There’s just not enough redundancy.
I’m in the market, and the answer is kinda, for non Teslas. I do a road trip up the east coast a few times a year and the Tesla will reliably add about 4 30 minute stops on each half of the trip. A non Tesla also requires four stops, but they could be anywhere from 20 minutes best case to 1 hr plus, depending on the availability and status of the unreliable chargers.
A lucid with 400 miles of true range would probably cut it down to two stops, but I don’t have $140k
I test drove the mach-e and really liked it. And it has a surprisingly large amount of storage due to the well designed frunk. The California edition has more than enough range for me. However, the abysmal charging speed has me worried about battery condition. If it’s that slow to charge it means the battery isn’t good under load.
Auto makers “slashing prices.” With perhaps one or 2 small exceptions, can you actually go out and buy an EV for under 40K in the US? Didn’t think so. Seems to be a whole lotta confusion about “demand” and the manufacturers actually making an electric car that normal people can afford.
My next car purchase if at all, will be some plugin electric (full or hybrid). The only reason I haven’t purchased it yet is because the form factor I am looking for in a car hasn’t been made in a plug in variety yet.
Also the stories about constant surveillance and tracking, and the push for shit-tier infotainment when I already have one in my pocket (phone) are not helping either.
Just make a dumb battery on wheels, already.
This is a concern for me also. Tesla is the Apple of car companies: hipster-centric, proprietary everything, overpriced, and really bad from a privacy perspective.
I was looking at Toyotas as I hear they are reliable and have PHEV and other options, but supposedly their data privacy is also extremely poor.
I don’t need a lot of the “smart” features of modern cars. I don’t need my car phoning the mother ship with it’s precise location and other metadata every 3/5 of a second.
I only want a rock solid drive train, basic usable control interface, a radio and maybe a USB port to play my own MP3s. Don’t need apps or even navigation. I feel like most EVs are very centered on bell and whistle features and their cost is greatly inflated because of it.
Personally, I’m keen to see if the proverbial doors get blown off the first few gens of electric cars, and the FOSS community makes headway.
I would happily buy an old Leaf if I knew we could handle all the software ourselves, and just do battery swaps when the range wasn’t enough any more.
Super just curious, what kind of form factor are you looking for? Any upcoming releases that match it?
Gen 2 chevy volt owner here, PHEVs are absolutely not a step back. If I didn’t buy the volt, the one car our family could afford would have been an ICE car. IMO, these things help bridge idealism with current reality - for most of my day-to-day, I drive a fully electric car. I just also get the option to toss some gas into it when on a long road trip.
Probably the best bet right now. Both from a cost perspective and using resources better. One big battery in a single car vs 10 batteries in 10 PHEV. If we want to make a real impact right now the PHEV are a great choice and can reach more people. Then of course, the best is not drive any car at all, asvoften as possible. Taking public transport or walking/cycling is much better than than any BEV, imagine if every car owner would drive 10% less, that would make a huge impact. Much larger than building a fuck ton of BEVs from a sustainability standpoint.
Yeah, this. For people with short commutes and in the market for a compact I strongly recommend the Prius Prime. Having a vehicle that can get to work and back without using gas at all, but also can go on long road trips without range anxiety? Perfect. And as an entry-level into the plug-in world, it’s nice that I can charge it on regular 110 instead of having to think about an upgrade to an oven-port.
There is no way in hell I’m paying 30k for a Prius.
It’s well worth it.
General Motors is thinking about bringing back plug-in hybrids
GREAT! Ditching PHEV’s was a stupid idea, we don’t have the charging infrastructure for most people to buy EV’s moving forward. We need an interim solution, and PHEV’s work great. They use a LOT less gas for most people (depending on driving habits) but you have the fuel tank in case you’re on a long road trip, or in a charging desert.
Have y’all seen the new Prius Prime? It starts at $33k, it actually looks kinda cool (subjectively), and it’s FAST (objectively). We need more cars like that.
Highly depends on where you are in the world. I feel like PHEVs might make some sense in America, in Europe demand is shrinking every year since charging networks have gotten fairly good and BEVs offer more flexibility in terms of charging, especially if you can’t charge at home.
They arguably do in Australia, since the charging infrastructure is poor to non-existent in some places.
Melbourne, one of the major cities, has about seven charging stations for the entire metropolis. Until the charging network is built up more effectively, if you live there, it would make more sense to buy a PHEV to tide you over until it became practical to run electric all the time.
I live in a relatively small town in Germany (about 8k residents) and we have mutiple public charging stations here. Insane how bad the infrastructure is over in Australia.
I read some studies that PHEV owners don’t plug in. So there should not be any tax credits for the purchase.
If we want to do anything to stimulate, there should be something based on electric driving.
PHEV is not the same as a common hybrid. It’s literally in the name.
That would not surprise me at all.
In the UK, they have a huge tax incentive as company cars. People are definitely getting them for the tax benefig, and not giving a shit about the electrics.Though honestly, if it means almost all company cars are at least regenerative braking, and the tech is there is someone does want to use it, it’s not the worst thing.
I might end up with a PHEV in a few years, as most of my driving is very short distance, and I can’t justify the cost of a 200mi+ BEV for the 1 trip a month that needs it. And putting second hand PHEVs on the market helps that.
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PHEV in my opinion is a really dumb idea. It got popular, because it was an easy way for car manufacturers to continue making large SUVs and adhere to even stricter fuel efficiency restrictions, while also benefitting from generous state subsidies. Now that those subsidies are either scaled down or completely removed the PHEV sector is shrinking fast.
The benefit of EV is not only that you can charge at your own garage but that you also have lower maintenance cost and even if the upfront cost is higher, your cost over time lowers the more you drive it and depending on electricity prices, etc. you can break even with ICE.
With PHEV, the maintenance cost is higher than ICE, because at the end you need to service and maintain two engines.
At the same time, a PHEV is a good stopgap if you live in a place with poor charging infrastructure. You might be able to charge enough to drive locally, but not when going some place farther afield. For example, I may be able to charge enough to drive around the neighbourhood from my socket, but literally half the city does not have any kind of EV charging capability, making a BEV unsuitable.
A PHEV would do better there, since I could switch to petrol if needed, and run in EV mode otherwise, and when charging infrastructure becomes good enough that I can live without the petrol part, then it might be worth switching to BEV.
PHEV in my opinion is a really dumb idea. It got popular, because it was an easy way for car manufacturers to continue making large SUVs and adhere to even stricter fuel efficiency restrictions, while also benefitting from generous state subsidies. Now that those subsidies are either scaled down or completely removed the PHEV sector is shrinking fast.
I’d argue that to be less of a issue with PHEV, since they weren’t all that common to start with, and more of an issue with things like Mild Hybrids where the motor is just there to give the ICE a little boost, and precious little else.
With PHEV, the maintenance cost is higher than ICE, because at the end you need to service and maintain two engines.
I would be curious if they are. ECVT systems don’t seem that much more complex than an equivalent automatic transmission, since the motor doubles as the starter and internal brake bands.
Maybe for the diesel-electric locomotive-type drivetrain that Opel’s Ampera-E uses, since it’s basically an EV with an onboard generator, but even then, maintenance costs could easily be offset by the ICE not running as often or as hard.
The catalytic converters of hybrid cars are often sought after because they are cleaner and don’t see as much wear as their ICE counterparts. It would not be much of a stretch for that logic to extend to hybrid engines.
IMO its a great idea right now because IIRC 90% of round trips are 50 miles or less. So if you have a 200 mile battery, 75% of it is dead weight most the time. PHEVs remove the range anxiety present in most parts of the US with poor charger networks. Plus if battery manufacturing becomes a bottleneck in the near future it will be good to reduce the amount needed per car.
Maybe in the future good charger networks and much cheaper batteries will solve the problem but for the next 20 years I think PHEVs will fill an important role.
No. It all depends on how you drive it. If you just drive a PHEV around town and do the occasional road trip (which is how most people drive) then the ICE engine sees very little wear and requires very little service.
If you’re doing constant road trips and burning up the road, a PHEV is not for you. And neither is an EV, honestly.
An EV would work if the infrastructure was there. Modern EV batteries can charge full in like 15 minutes but it’s not even gonna take that long cause you’ll obviously not be plugging it in at 0%. The charger needs to support that amount of power throughput tho tbf.
An EV would work if the infrastructure was there.
Right, but it’s not yet. So a PHEV is a better option for most people (for now).
It’s still more viable in regions where people don’t have personal garages, and their apartment parking lot doesn’t support retrofitting charging stands.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
And now the EPA is considering slowing down requirements for automakers to sell more electric vehicles, dialing back what had been aggressive plans to move away from gas powered cars and SUVs.
Industry experts cite a number of reasons for this, including vehicle price, lack of charging capacity and confusing tax credit rules.
Besides being too expensive for the average buyer, selection is limited in terms of body style, said Corey Cantor, an industry analyst with Bloomberg New Energy Finance.
This is why Ford recently cut prices for the Mach-E SUV and why Farley created a team to work on a less expensive EV engineering platform that will be the basis for future models.
BMW, GM, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Mercedes-Benz, and Stellantis have come together to create a joint venture that plans to install about 30,000 chargers across the United States and Canada.
In the words of the Portuguese auto executive, who spoke to journalists in New York recently, public EV charging needs to “jump on your face” before most customers will consider an electric vehicle.
The original article contains 1,022 words, the summary contains 176 words. Saved 83%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
Hertz is also selling a lot of its rental Teslas, which is probably cutting into the new car sales.
😱NO! Its all just a lie…keep buying EVs.
