Downvotes can be a useful tool to shape a community, but one of the main issues brought up in the post I made is when several people start downvoting communities they don’t even participate in. Which I want to emphasize is NOT the correct way for downvotes to be used.

First id like to start off with an apology to those who are upset about them being enabled. It may seem very clear to you that downvotes weren’t wanted, but as an admin I get complaints for basically every decision made on this site, so what the “right” choice is, is sometimes hard to determine.

I’ve been getting complaints about downvotes being disabled for awhile now, so it wasn’t clear to me. Even now, the opinion is still very split. Which is why I enabled them quietly to see if it would cause any issues. It did, so I made the initial post to see if people think the issues created by downvotes outweigh the benefits, and what peoples’ other opinions about them are.

This is my opinion based on what I’ve read and the results of the poll:

I think at a later time when lemmynsfw is larger, downvotes may be viable, especially if lemmy implements a custom home feed so that not everyone sees the same posts. This would help mitigate the issue of people not in communities downvoting posts. But as it stands I think the best option is disabling them again. Frequent posters, which are kind of needed for this site to survive, don’t seem to like them, and the poll is split almost 50/50. I have to try to balance enjoyability of posting and enjoyability of consuming content on the site, and it just seems like downvotes really hurts posters and only marginally helps consumers.

So with all that said, downvotes have been disabled again. Sorry for all the confusion and back and forth.

  • Madness@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
    0·
    8 个月前

    I’ve been blocking communities for around 300+ so far. The communities that I’m not interested. I’ve been doing this since day 1 and still keep checking new communities every day. For either subscribe or block.

    I just want for people here having fun without getting downvotes so much because they’re not interested in such content per se.

  • Dgenthicklad@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    4 个月前

    Maybe announce/pin a polls that’s going to be used to base important decisions for an instance on. Missed the poll, definitely think disabling was a bad idea

  • lnsfw3@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    Thanks for involving the community in the decision.

    It’s nice to see active admins on our instance.

  • Radovic@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    I want to thank you lemmyposter212 for this fair minded decision. I know that we’ll probably revisit this subject in a number of months and then maybe the decision will be different and I shall probably bow out gracefully at that point rather than mount a protest.

    I also want to thank the other posters and commenters who showed up to support each other, particularly @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] and @[email protected]

    But for right now I have another problem which is how to go about restoring the posts I blanked out. What I intend to do is to go through and try to match the titles to their original picture and then I shall make a weekly digest post of the ones that have been restored so that the people who haven’t seen them before can enjoy them.

    Normal service will be resumed as soon as possible.

      • Radovic@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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        8 个月前

        Thanks for those kind words, you’ve been commenting on my posts for a while now and it’s those small acts of appreciation for what I do that make the difference.

            • b9999998@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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              8 个月前

              Have you considered modding at some of the communities you post to? Be glad to add you to some of my comms if you are interested

              • Radovic@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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                8 个月前

                You saw how I react to things during this whole debate, I’m not the type of person you want dealing with your users. About twenty years ago I used to mod on an early file-sharing network and even that tiny bit of power went to my head and I started to go a little bit mad with it. It taught me that I’m not really a fit person to be in charge of anything but me 😁

                I appreciate the offer but I can promise you that you’d regret it. I want to stick to what I came here to do, which is share the pictures I’ve saved with other people.

  • BearOfaTime@lemm.eeEnglish
    0·
    8 个月前

    people start downvoting communities they don’t even participate in. Which I want to emphasize is NOT the correct way for downvotes to be used.

    Says who?

    If you don’t want people voting in a community, then maybe change the community to block voting by non-members. I don’t know if this is technical option right now, and frankly I don’t care. If that’s what you want in your community, then that’s for you to address. Not just come on here and act like Mr. Dictator and tell people how to use communities.

    At a minimum what you’re doing is ineffective, nut it’s also adversarial. I didn’t even read past this sentence, and I have no intention of going back and reading the rest. Why should I when you’ve shown how you view everyone else, as merely pawns to be told how to behave.

    And why would I want to join a community when you’re so condescending to people?

    Sheesh.

    • Ledivin@lemmy.worldEnglish
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      8 个月前

      Holy victim complex, batman. The sentence to reacted so strongly to was the lightest criticism anyone could ever give on any subject.

    • Rtc@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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      8 个月前

      Of all the points you could pick, you pick the anti-bullying one. The point of local, which is the only place where this would apply, is where all the posts which gain a large number of votes in their own communities are put. It is a place where even everything nsfw, as long as it does not break sitewide rules, is also welcome. The only reason to downvote such a thing rather than browse subscriptions instead or ignore the post and move on, in practical terms, would be acting on going out of your way for making sure they don’t exist. To tell those posters to just fuck off and go away, even when they didn’t decide to put it outside the community.

      And this dude seriously argued that point under the argument of morality hahahahaha. Hahahaha hahahahahahahaha.

  • CombedSpaghetti@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    Thanks for being open and honest with the community. I’ll admit I’m disappointed by the decision. But you did the right thing by communicating and letting the community help shape the decision.

  • jet@hackertalks.comEnglish
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    4 个月前

    Consider leaving downvotes on, but ban people who only downvote in a community (this can be automated). It’s a form of unsubscribe for the user who doesn’t like the content. After a initial adjustment window downvotes will be relevant again.

      • jet@hackertalks.comEnglish
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        4 个月前

        Does it really have to be part of Lemmy itself? I just use some poorly written bash scripts.

        • lemmyposter212@lemmynsfw.comOPMEnglish
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          4 个月前

          It would have to be a docker container or part of lemmy itself, or some sort of service, currently nothing like that exists, so that would take dev time. We are all volunteers here and have day jobs, so that’s not exactly viable

  • lushlyPurveyor@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    … several people start downvoting communities they don’t even participate in

    Could you elaborate what you mean by that? Does “participating” mean subscribing? Commenting? Posting?
    Also what does “downvoting communities” mean? People go in and downvote every post?

    • MaybeALittleBitWeird@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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      8 个月前

      People go in and downvote every post?

      Yes. A common issue has consistently been that people will downvote all posts for a specific community or subject, whether that’s something gay, a specific hentai, or a more niche fetish/kink that they don’t personally find appealing rather than blocking it. These posts are usually relevant and quality submissions for the community that they’re posted to, but end up with negative scores because of differing preferences.

  • esthete@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    And … the local feed is back to unusable while the overall quality in subscribed subs is down.

    Unfortunately very predictable result.

    • Rtc@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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      8 个月前

      does people sharing their dicks for others and not you irritate you so much🤔

  • bluejay@lemm.eeEnglish
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    8 个月前

    Isn’t voting a way to participate? Is there a way to semi-lock the community instead so random drifters don’t come in a vote bomb?

      • X-Graphica@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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        8 个月前

        Thank you for dedicating your time and trouble to this platform lemmyposter212. I’m sure the shit and abuse you get every day makes it all worthwhile.

        Perhaps in the future, consideration for a feature that allows the Mod of the community to opt in or out of allowing downvoting might be considered, specific to just that community. This would take the debate out of the Admins hands, give new posters a chance to get started without being bashed, and provide an outlet for those who just need to downvote something.

        Cheers

  • Raven@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    This is the right decision. I did not want to add an opinion and leave the majority decide, but the issue is downvotes are not used correctly.

  • xxdumplesxx@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    I think removing down votes was the correct decision. We need to let all community grow and curate your own feed. Sometimes I like to see what else is out there even if it isn’t what I normally like.

  • kyle@lemm.eeEnglish
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    8 个月前

    I was personally on the fence anyway, but I really appreciate your work and explanation for decisions. You don’t have to do that but it means a lot!

  • tentaclius@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    Just to say something in opposition to criticism expressed in other comments… No matter what you choose there will be upset people in comments, and as an admin you can make decisions you see fit here as you are the one doing most of the work. There will always be people upset with the decision, but so far I believe you are doing great job!

  • ReallyActuallyFrankenstein@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
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    8 个月前

    I voted to enable downvotes due to an increase in bad faith comments and posts in some communities, and removing downvotes allows trolls and sealions to artificially appear neutral when in fact they are rightfully buried. It also discourages commenters when those bad-faith debates eat up comment sections.

    That said, I completely understand the rationale above and it convinced me that I voted the wrong way. Makes total sense that most people misuse downvotes, and I agree with disabling for now.